Wait times/ Layovers

I never use the word free. No one would belive me if I did.

Rather,
For cross border, 2 hours included in the base rate for TL, 1 hour for LTL
For local, 1 hour included in the base rate for TL, 30 minutes for LTL

If it's an order Bourassa is handling, there will be WT no matter how fast the shipper moves so ensure you build that into your base rate. :)

Keep well,
Mike
 
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And really I think those times are WAY too long...2 hours included that turns into an extra hour and then some, if there is a delay. End of the day that could be an extra +/- 150 miles the driver is closer to the destination. That is time that the driver never gets back. Add on a few extra delays through out the week and that could be the difference between getting a reload back home on Friday or having to lay over the weekend until the next load is available. I get it things happen, but far too often these waiting times are pushed and pushed and the both the person paying and the person receiving the added funds nickles and dimes the other.

Both shippers and receivers are at the extremes though one can unload in no time, while the other has a break then lunch and probably a shift change just for the hell of it, where there is time lost between shifts too.

There is very little reason (in most cases) why a shipper can't load an empty van trailer inside of an hour.

Kevin.
 
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Got to love when your truck gets loaded and moving down the highway that your broker gives you an off load appointment 4 days after you will arrive at receiver. So now all you do is sit and wait for next 4 days. Not cool
 
Should be no such thing as "free" waiting time.
If you have an appointment and your on time and they can't off-load, your waiting time starts immediately.
It's the brokers who screw this up because they bid nothing to get the load and then say they don't have money in it for any waiting time.
It's simple - whether the broker gets paid or not is irrelevant - if the broker hires the carrier, they hire based on the carriers requirements - not the brokers and this includes carriers payment terms.
Where did it ever get that the broker who wants it picked up now, sets the delivery date/time, tracks and traces the crap out of it - and then decides to pay when they feel like it?
Keep the posts in here going - it helps to keep everyone informed and those that get a bad rap should not be used under any circumstances - let's drive them off the link and out of business.
 
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Hi Shakey.
We do work with some very reputable brokers and appreciate them for sure.
I'm just concerned as a guy who's been in the industry a long time that slowly but surely, the integrity we all enjoyed as a group is disappearing.
Anything you subscribe to has certain criteria you must abide by or your not on it - Load Link does a terrible job at this and Claudia and the group needs to hear from the honest carriers/brokers and maybe, just maybe we can keep some remnants of integrity in the industry.
This board keeping people connected is a great way as well.
 
fedup said:
Hi Shakey.
We do work with some very reputable brokers and appreciate them for sure.
I'm just concerned as a guy who's been in the industry a long time that slowly but surely, the integrity we all enjoyed as a group is disappearing.
Anything you subscribe to has certain criteria you must abide by or your not on it - Load Link does a terrible job at this and Claudia and the group needs to hear from the honest carriers/brokers and maybe, just maybe we can keep some remnants of integrity in the industry.
This board keeping people connected is a great way as well.
Click to expand...

I've taken some great info from this site to help run businesses better and keep the unscrupulous characters away from our clients freight...................unfortunately I've still been bitten but hopefully less that I would have been.
 
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Paying carriers cuts into broker profit , some don't care about a relationship .
they don’t want to lose customer or upset them or want to ask for waiting time .
‘it’s getting worse , 2 hrs to 3 hrs free. Than 75 dollars went to 50 dollars , or they cap your pay at 250 , After 8 hrs of waiting time Now they use the word ‘ work in” . Driver and companies need to be paid , their rates are tight enough than add 3 hrs of non paid hours .
 
Am I missing something here??

Who pays their drivers by hours ?

NOBODY unless its a city driver. Some drivers dont even get a rpm they just get a flat rate for every trip especially east coast. Almost every single driver only gets paid while incurring miles.

So to be honest waiting time is a fake charge. Its only costing the carrier time off the next load, but when their is 3 hours wait time at a rcvr or shipper the driver isnt going to get paid 1 single penny extra and the company isnt actually losing money... Wait times are the cost of doing business.

And on the flip side, when a broker does pay a carrier waiting time , how often does the waiting time actually trickle down to the driver? NEVER! they still have to beg for waiting time or a 50.00$ layover. Especially at these companies that start salary at .44cents a mile
 
shayne said:
Am I missing something here??

Who pays their drivers by hours ?

NOBODY unless its a city driver. Some drivers dont even get a rpm they just get a flat rate for every trip especially east coast. Almost every single driver only gets paid while incurring miles.

So to be honest waiting time is a fake charge. Its only costing the carrier time off the next load, but when their is 3 hours wait time at a rcvr or shipper the driver isnt going to get paid 1 single penny extra and the company isnt actually losing money... Wait times are the cost of doing business.

And on the flip side, when a broker does pay a carrier waiting time , how often does the waiting time actually trickle down to the driver? NEVER! they still have to beg for waiting time or a 50.00$ layover. Especially at these companies that start salary at .44cents a mile
Click to expand...

So you say wait times are the cost of the doing business for the carrier...What about the broker? Apply your same logic to the broker side, just the cost of doing business.
 
shayne said:
Am I missing something here??

Who pays their drivers by hours ?

NOBODY unless its a city driver. Some drivers dont even get a rpm they just get a flat rate for every trip especially east coast. Almost every single driver only gets paid while incurring miles.

So to be honest waiting time is a fake charge. Its only costing the carrier time off the next load, but when their is 3 hours wait time at a rcvr or shipper the driver isnt going to get paid 1 single penny extra and the company isnt actually losing money... Wait times are the cost of doing business.

And on the flip side, when a broker does pay a carrier waiting time , how often does the waiting time actually trickle down to the driver? NEVER! they still have to beg for waiting time or a 50.00$ layover. Especially at these companies that start salary at .44cents a mile
Click to expand...

Our drivers get a flat rate for a stop, then after 2 hours we pay them hourly for wait time, 1 hour on LTL. The last 4 places I have worked have done this, not sure who are you dealing with that would tell you otherwise?

Had a driver stuck at a shipper for 8 hours last week. as a result, he did not have the hours for the next load sitting in the yard for him because he could not get a reset in. We charged wait time, paid the driver and it still did not make up for the Florida load he lost out on as a result.

2 hours at the shipper or the receiver, that is the cost of doing business - anything above that hurts the carrier and the driver, and the next customer. It especially gets frustrating when we get 15 tracing calls the next day asking where the driver is and why are they running late. We request from the broker, broker gets it from the customer - and it should be the cost of doing business to THE BROKER if they are not able to collect it.

For us, layovers are dependent on the situation but always more then $50 and if we get more from the customer we pass it to the driver. If we get more for pain and suffering, we pass it on to the driver. One thing for sure is, the driver always get their wait time regardless of what a broker pays or does not pay - we can't hide under the excuse of "the customer won't approve the charges," which is BS because our contract is with the broker not the customer.
 
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Shayne what the hell? What carriers are you dealing with that treat their drivers so poorly? Maybe you need to find a better class of carriers. We pay our drivers otherwise we would not have any drivers, well any that you would want hauling your customers freight. We invest a lot to keep our drivers happy, I once had a driver complain about the pickup truck I was driving at the time, my question to him was "if I drove an old beat up pickup truck what kind of truck did he think he would be driving" his answer was "never thought of it that way". The trucks that we are buying today are around $225K+++ fully loaded Freightliners we treat our drivers right we have about 22 million dollars in equipment running the roads and we are a mid size carrier in Canada at best. If you want a definition of crazy well that is it for the amount of return we get every year so if it is sitting for 2 to 5 hours getting loaded/unloaded we need to get paid. I don't agree with Fedup's comments there is good and bad on both sides of the argument and I figure if someone screws us over it is truly their loss because we will never do business with them again and if asked we will tell our story and that company will find it harder and harder to get good carriers. That is my rant for the day as Rob would say.
 
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Exactly Raindog.
I have no issues with brokers receiving the correct rate from their clients and making money that way when they hire a carrier- more power to them.
The issue I have is some brokers hide facts that they know about their client (like no paid waiting time). They contract a carrier to get the lowest rate and then after the fact tell the carrier they don't get paid waiting time from their client and feel they don't owe the carrier anything. The carrier would have rated the load differently had they been given all the facts up front.
Once a broker contracts a carrier they are accepting the carriers terms - that mean EVERY term from waiting time, layovers and payment due dates.
If the broker can't (or won't accept those conditions), then hire another carrier but at least be up front about all the shipment details.
 
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RAINDOG said:
Our drivers get a flat rate for a stop, then after 2 hours we pay them hourly for wait time, 1 hour on LTL. The last 4 places I have worked have done this, not sure who are you dealing with that would tell you otherwise?

Had a driver stuck at a shipper for 8 hours last week. as a result, he did not have the hours for the next load sitting in the yard for him because he could not get a reset in. We charged wait time, paid the driver and it still did not make up for the Florida load he lost out on as a result.

2 hours at the shipper or the receiver, that is the cost of doing business - anything above that hurts the carrier and the driver, and the next customer. It especially gets frustrating when we get 15 tracing calls the next day asking where the driver is and why are they running late. We request from the broker, broker gets it from the customer - and it should be the cost of doing business to THE BROKER if they are not able to collect it.

For us, layovers are dependent on the situation but always more then $50 and if we get more from the customer we pass it to the driver. If we get more for pain and suffering, we pass it on to the driver. One thing for sure is, the driver always get their wait time regardless of what a broker pays or does not pay - we can't hide under the excuse of "the customer won't approve the charges," which is BS because our contract is with the broker not the customer.
Click to expand...
Yes what he said - we always pay the driver - ALL miles and wait time above 2 hrs and layovers - regardless of if we get paid because they are 'waiting for approval'
 
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I like how "rhymes with schmellmar" gets out of wait time.

Send you an order that you booked with them at 11:00, with an ETA to pick up at 13:00, getting load sheet at 11:30 with a 10:00 pickup time. Right away make a phone call and get the ol' "sorry, another carrier bailed so we can't change the appointment time. Just go in bro, we never have anyone there past 2 hours."

A- carrier probably bailed because rate was horrible to begin with and found something better (is what I tell myself as I don't want to believe we are set up to fail so they can pocket the wait time.)
B- now I am desperate because I need to move driver, so agree to the load (stupid me)
C- I remind them we are bailing them out with a recovery, please tell shipper we aren't the late ones but the recovery plan.
D- "Just go in Bro, it's all good."
E- Driver loses 5 hours loading because he was late and is now a "work-in"
F- I remind Delmar we were the recovery carrier and not the reason for being late, can you please call shipper
G- Radio silence, until loaded
H-Send wait time request
I- Sorry, can't pay you because YOU were late

I guess this the cost of doing business?
 
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