Full load rate from Montreal to Toronto
- Thread starter Paul S
- Start date
15
15
30
You will get offered from 450-600 or that has been my experience last month when my regular load was not ready. Pitiful but guys haul it for that 20 year old rate.
Kind of like the jackass that took XPO's $575 on a 563 mile Ontario to Illinois. Please carriers if you have to hold your ankles and grit your teeth tell these douchebags to stick the load up their ass.
If the rate ain't right don't turn the key to the right..
Now brokers before you go jumping all over my ass saying yes maybe a repositioning move or maybe they had good freight to come home with etc etc. That rate is pitiful and to unload and reload in the same town and come back to Mississauga they would need $1675 to get to 2 bucks a mile which is where van freight should be at a minimum
Kind of like the jackass that took XPO's $575 on a 563 mile Ontario to Illinois. Please carriers if you have to hold your ankles and grit your teeth tell these douchebags to stick the load up their ass.
If the rate ain't right don't turn the key to the right..
Now brokers before you go jumping all over my ass saying yes maybe a repositioning move or maybe they had good freight to come home with etc etc. That rate is pitiful and to unload and reload in the same town and come back to Mississauga they would need $1675 to get to 2 bucks a mile which is where van freight should be at a minimum
Last edited:
30
Rob, you have just explained supply and demand in a way that everyone should be able to understand. Both examples, Toronto/Montreal, and Toronto/Illinois represent lanes where there is always lots of supply and therefore a lower price. As you mentioned, the rates have been the same for years and years. In addition, especially with TO/Mtl., the distance is small enough to run home empty if push comes to shove. Should the rates be higher? Absolutely. Will they ever get there? Not until the imbalance of #trucks to #loads decreases.
30
It's completely supply and demand. But some lanes don't make sense and I find that the TO-MTL loop is one of them. You're better off taking a load to the US from Montreal and then coming home rather than doing a MTL-TO run.
I find getting much more than $600 on the lane customer direct is a stretch.
I find getting much more than $600 on the lane customer direct is a stretch.
30
Figure that a reefer trailer between the fuel and capital cost etc of $100 per day over dry, and boom, there it is.
5
We sell for $650.00 $725.00.
We often sell out FAST, some of my carriers say others offering $400.00- $500.00.
That's extremely low
We often sell out FAST, some of my carriers say others offering $400.00- $500.00.
That's extremely low
30
In 1988 I was hauling Dylex (Tip Top Tailor) loads from Montreal to Toronto. My carrier was getting $450.00 per load at the time.. mind you they were moving a lot of loads, and the rate was probably based on volume. At least it was all drop and hook and loads rarely exceeded 30 thousand pounds. I rarely get loads in that lane as I can't seem to quote low enough. Last week I quoted a guy in Brantford $600.00 all in for 3/4 truckload out of Cornwall to Brantford.. a load of twine of all things. He told me my rate was about 25% too high compared to his other vendors.
5
There are several low ballers.
I remind my clients to call me when the truck is out off gas.
Were all here to make a $
30
I guess that's why nobody specializes in that lane. Flatbed rates are great.. but van rates suck badly.
20
Why would anyone quote to 'get a load' at a rate that doesn't cover costs? The same thing is happening with loads from Toronto to Montreal. We took a load at $625 a few weeks ago. We use to get that for a 1/2 load... Coming back empty is not a real option but that rate doesn't really cover what it costs to run. The cheap rate from MTL to TO is because there are a HUGE number of Ontario companies quoting loads out of MTL at ON rates. That's how they are underbidding Quebec companies now...
So now we are being paid 'to loose less money' rather than to 'make a little profit'. One day this is going to bite you all in the butt...
I know, I can hear you all now. We're all out to do business. BUT, When we base our business on just 'GETTING THE LOADS' instead of covering the costs... and no one is making money... WOW I might be stupid but that's not what I learned in Economics...
So now we are being paid 'to loose less money' rather than to 'make a little profit'. One day this is going to bite you all in the butt...
I know, I can hear you all now. We're all out to do business. BUT, When we base our business on just 'GETTING THE LOADS' instead of covering the costs... and no one is making money... WOW I might be stupid but that's not what I learned in Economics...
30
You're not out of line on this.
The rate to Montreal from Toronto is usually a fair bit higher than this. On any imbalanced lane one will find that the rates are lopsided and sometimes the rate in one direction is below cost ... but as long as the round trip revenue justifies it, there isn't a problem.
But if the freight rate in both directions is weak (and 625 TO-MTL is weak) then unless it is one-off it will lead to capacity leaving the lane (and the marketplace, if a lot of lanes are suffering the same fate). And it all cycles around and the market fixes itself. That's actually Economics 101.
The market has fouled in the past 6-9 months, that's for sure.
The rate to Montreal from Toronto is usually a fair bit higher than this. On any imbalanced lane one will find that the rates are lopsided and sometimes the rate in one direction is below cost ... but as long as the round trip revenue justifies it, there isn't a problem.
But if the freight rate in both directions is weak (and 625 TO-MTL is weak) then unless it is one-off it will lead to capacity leaving the lane (and the marketplace, if a lot of lanes are suffering the same fate). And it all cycles around and the market fixes itself. That's actually Economics 101.
The market has fouled in the past 6-9 months, that's for sure.
30
Toronto-Montreal van rates have never been any good, at least not in the 30 years I've been in the biz. It's simply supply and demand. Carriers who have LTL loads going one way will quote low on truckloads simply to move the truck back to their home destination quickly. Every so often a truckload carrier will come along and try to live in that lane.. (like Lavigne Transport some years back). They go for awhile based on a large account like Ikea, and then it all falls apart when they realize volume isn't the answer to everything. The only way to make Toronto-Montreal work on a steady basis is LTL one or both ways. Truckload both ways isn't sustainable unless you've got some angle like specialized equipment (4 legged flatbed pays very well in that lane).
30
My past employer was running probably close to half of the fleet on dedicated loops GTA-GMA. The rate would end up being somewhere in the $1200-$1300 range using their trailers, and they were not single drop loads. Most times we wouldn't have backhaul from GMA-GTA from the customer so we would fill with broker freight when possible and rebate most of it back. But man, it was a struggle to find anything decent to bring back on the laneway.
Point being ... in decent market conditions running dry on the lane back and forth on your own trailers should bring around $1300 on a round, if it's reefer then you need to add $150 or so on the round for it to make sense. But in today's market, I don't see how it can be done particularly if you're looking to the spot market.
At that place and here, we find we're better off to run triangles ... meaning if we have to take a load to GTA instead of GMA from the US, we are better off loading back down to the US than to come home as long as we don't stick a driver in BFN during a weekend or holiday.
Point being ... in decent market conditions running dry on the lane back and forth on your own trailers should bring around $1300 on a round, if it's reefer then you need to add $150 or so on the round for it to make sense. But in today's market, I don't see how it can be done particularly if you're looking to the spot market.
At that place and here, we find we're better off to run triangles ... meaning if we have to take a load to GTA instead of GMA from the US, we are better off loading back down to the US than to come home as long as we don't stick a driver in BFN during a weekend or holiday.
20
I'm a little confused. How on earth would anybody make any money running rounders to Montreal at $1300, let alone investing another $60000 over and above for a reefer and getting an extra $150???
