The Funny Thing About ELOGs ...

Michael Ludwig

Well-Known Member
20
Over the next several days, weeks, and months, we are all going to hear some pretty funny stories about shippers and receivers, and how they deal with ELOGs. I thought I would start a thread so we would all have a singular place to tell our stories and let everyone else have a good laff too.
 

Michael Ludwig

Well-Known Member
20
One of my random thoughts today lead me down the path to thinking about clementine loads. Actually it was triggered by someone looking for clem rates this year.
Clems are probably going to start right about the time ELOGs become mandatory. As everyone from the reefer side of the business knows, hauling clems is a hurry up and wait process to get loaded with a delivery window of "I want it yesterday", only to arrive at the receiver (Loblaws is the worst) and wait 24 hours to get unloaded.
Since I am not going to participate in that rat race this year ... unless I get paid a ridiculously, stupid amount of money ... $3,000.00 USD if anyone is interested ... I would dearly love to hear from those of you that do. I suspect they will be out of trucks about 3 boats in.
 

bellcitytransport

Well-Known Member
20
One of my random thoughts today lead me down the path to thinking about clementine loads. Actually it was triggered by someone looking for clem rates this year.
Clems are probably going to start right about the time ELOGs become mandatory. As everyone from the reefer side of the business knows, hauling clems is a hurry up and wait process to get loaded with a delivery window of "I want it yesterday", only to arrive at the receiver (Loblaws is the worst) and wait 24 hours to get unloaded.
Since I am not going to participate in that rat race this year ... unless I get paid a ridiculously, stupid amount of money ... $3,000.00 USD if anyone is interested ... I would dearly love to hear from those of you that do. I suspect they will be out of trucks about 3 boats in.
Clementines have started...and yup should be fun. Customers expect your truck to have full hours to make delivery next morning. NOT going to happen. Even IF I held a truck over to load next day for you so driver is fresh, by the time driver leaves truck stop in the morning, gets to the port, sits, waits, waits some more. Won't have the hours to make next day delivery. Can't wait to hear the stories. How are companies suppose to make a profit at these rates on these truck doing these loads and loads like it.
 

Freight Broker

Well-Known Member
30
Elogs are going to be a painful adjustment for many of us.. but over the long term it will make the industry better. No one can expect a driver to run illegal anymore... or require the driver to stretch the truth on their logs. Shippers and receivers are going to have to up their game and really get drivers in and out the door as fast as possible. In the short term, shippers/receivers who are known to be "slow" will simply not get any trucks until they can show that they've changed their practices. Some people are going to learn the hard way!
 

Salma

Well-Known Member
20
I disagree about the "slow" shippers/receivers. I don't believe places like Walmart or Loblaws will make any changes whatsoever due to elogs. I hope I am wrong but I won't hold my breath.
 

dad2andrew

Well-Known Member
20
Salma I agree. I used to pick up at a place in PA and they were notorious for holding a driver. Sometimes easily 6+ hours with out batting an eye. If you got in before 8am and after 5pm (24/7 shipper so some flexibility), you were pretty good with easily in and out 1 hour. No unload/reload, just load the 22 skids! They just had no sense of urgency or how HOS worked. Glad I'm not dealing with them anymore!

I wonder if more shippers might be more open to the drop/hook scenarios now for regular carriers/customers. If I could swing that on any lane I would.
 

Freight Broker

Well-Known Member
30
I disagree about the "slow" shippers/receivers. I don't believe places like Walmart or Loblaws will make any changes whatsoever due to elogs. I hope I am wrong but I won't hold my breath.

I don't think they'll make changes due to elogs.. but they will make changes when they can't get trucks. it's not carved in stone that they need to be inefficient.. they're that way now becuase they CAN be that way.. i.e. there's no incentive to change.
 

Salma

Well-Known Member
20
I don't think they'll make changes due to elogs.. but they will make changes when they can't get trucks. it's not carved in stone that they need to be inefficient.. they're that way now becuase they CAN be that way.. i.e. there's no incentive to change.

Most of the "slow" shippers/receivers are unionized so the "I can take 6+ hours to load/unload a truck" scenario won't be changing anytime soon.
On a somewhat unrelated note.... many times we have delivered to receivers who employ Mexicans or other immigrants to work on the dock and my trucks are in and out of the dock door, having delivered a full truckload, in under 30 minutes.... just sayin'....
 

hauling_ass

Active Member
15
I wonder how things would work if the HoS rules changed? For instance, a driver has 14 hours in a 24 hour period to drive - and he can break it up however he needs to. So, if your driver shows up at the "Slower than Molasses" factory and sits for 5 hours, that could be booked as off duty.

I know,I know...he is still 'awake' BUT right now, there is no guarantee that your driver doesn't spend his mandatory 10 hours off duty watching Netflix (or sitting in a truck stop shootin' the breeze).

Too simple?
 

Freight Broker

Well-Known Member
30
Over the course of my career I've seen many shippers/receivers make positive changes to their operations. Some have gone from dead last to first in their ability to handle trucks in and out efficiently. It's not a moonshot.. it just requires an incentive most of the time. It ain't carved in stone that certain parties are destined to be inefficient.
 

chica123

Site Supporter
30
My personal and humble opinion is that Elogs are not the real problem here. The real problem is the HOS rules. How many times has a driver wanted to pull over to take a 1/2 hour or 1 hour power nap but does not do so, because if he/she does, the hours will run out? I could go on and on...I know they have to have some sort of rules by which drivers must obide, but I believe the ones they have crafted have it all wrong....
Ok everyone, attack away...lol
 

bull958

Site Supporter
20
I wonder how things would work if the HoS rules changed? For instance, a driver has 14 hours in a 24 hour period to drive - and he can break it up however he needs to. So, if your driver shows up at the "Slower than Molasses" factory and sits for 5 hours, that could be booked as off duty.

I know,I know...he is still 'awake' BUT right now, there is no guarantee that your driver doesn't spend his mandatory 10 hours off duty watching Netflix (or sitting in a truck stop shootin' the breeze).

Too simple?
A company I drove for had a letter from the MTO allowing us to mark off duty at a place like Loblaws because they do not allow the driver inside the warehouse and lock your trailer to the dock. As far as they were concerned, the driver had relinquished control of the vehicle.
 

Rob

Site Supporter
30
My personal and humble opinion is that Elogs are not the real problem here. The real problem is the HOS rules. How many times has a driver wanted to pull over to take a 1/2 hour or 1 hour power nap but does not do so, because if he/she does, the hours will run out? I could go on and on...I know they have to have some sort of rules by which drivers must obide, but I believe the ones they have crafted have it all wrong....
Ok everyone, attack away...lol


I agree 100% the 14 hours is lots but being able to stop it for a nap or to wait out traffic is key. I ran Wisconsin pretty steady when I was an o/o here. We would get loaded about 2-3 pm head for the truckstop have a nap for a couple hours go in and shower and eat and blast right down through Chicago and head for West Lorne. Pull in there get another 6 or so hours in the bunk and head to TO unload reload and head back. Being forced to work tired is about safety??
 

Igor Galanter

Well-Known Member
20
Same with me, Bull...My company supplied us with the letter allowing mark OF DUTY or SLEEPER BERTH time on customer property during load/ unload IF we were not involved in the process ( count or hand bomb).. Worked for us...
 

Grant C

New Member
2
Over the next several days, weeks, and months, we are all going to hear some pretty funny stories about shippers and receivers, and how they deal with ELOGs. I thought I would start a thread so we would all have a singular place to tell our stories and let everyone else have a good laff too.
I think that one of the greatest challenges will be in training Drivers, or should I say re-training Drivers in how to us
I agree 100% the 14 hours is lots but being able to stop it for a nap or to wait out traffic is key. I ran Wisconsin pretty steady when I was an o/o here. We would get loaded about 2-3 pm head for the truckstop have a nap for a couple hours go in and shower and eat and blast right down through Chicago and head for West Lorne. Pull in there get another 6 or so hours in the bunk and head to TO unload reload and head back. Being forced to work tired is about safety??
I have a lot of mixed thoughts about this, I agree that a driver sometimes needs to pull over and close his eyes for 20 minutes, I've spent 16 years running the corridor and have done it myself. I also get the idea that a driver's internal clock doesn't always run in harmony with the MOT/DOT clock. I've worked both long haul and city, but the better part of my driving career was spent running nights on the 401 corridor. Working either days in the city or running the corridor at night enabled me to at least adjust my sleeping habits. Long Haul required a lot of trip planning and often required leaving earlier so that when I slept or took my breaks, I didn't end up running into rush hour traffic through the major cities. With the H.O.S. as they are, it wasn't too bad in Canada because you could split your total 10 hours off any way you wanted to, as long as both periods were 2hrs or more in duration. In the U.S. you "have to" take 8 hrs off in the sleeper birth as part of your daily 10 hrs off-duty requirement, and that in itself could hold you up 2 hrs in rush hour traffic. Most dispatch software calculates delivery times and when a load has to be moved by taking the distance to delivery/ 50mph, so now you have dispatch waiting to the last minute to assign loads, expecting the driver to do what the dispatch software says he/ she can without pre-planning a trip. My humble opinion is that both H.O.S. regulations (DOT/ MOT) need to be unified as one set of rules for both the US and Canada, TMS or TMW systems need to calculate delivery times based on the historical delivery times, if they don't have that information on hand, then they can go to the vehicle position history on their telematics platform and query the last couple of trucks that delivered to a given location and take the mean average for the time it took to deliver. It wouldn't take a smart Carrier long to build a data base tailored to projecting ETA's for his customer's freight. Lastly, if the industry wants to retain their drivers and get "New Blood", they have to put more emphasis on higher wages and company wide H.O.S. training, so that Drivers can utilize their available hours more efficiently and, at the end of the week bring home a decent paycheque. (and yes, I think dispatchers really need to be trained as well).

Grant Conrad
 

ctsi

Member
10
No one seems to be mentioning other delays such as the famous U.S. Customs. I have sat for hours in line waiting just to get to the bridge, trying to get over that, only to find two customs booths open and after getting there to be sent to X-ray, sit in another line (usually takes about 45 minutes) and then sent to agriculture for inspection. This whole process can take hours off your clock. I'm not even going to get into traffic delays. A simple 10 hour drive has now taken on a new life and the receivers and customers don't care. "It's part of the job and comes with the territory" (so I have been told on more than one occasion) and the list goes on. Nobody seems to allow for these kind of delays.
 

Michael Ludwig

Well-Known Member
20
No one seems to be mentioning other delays such as the famous U.S. Customs. I have sat for hours in line waiting just to get to the bridge, trying to get over that, only to find two customs booths open and after getting there to be sent to X-ray, sit in another line (usually takes about 45 minutes) and then sent to agriculture for inspection. This whole process can take hours off your clock. I'm not even going to get into traffic delays. A simple 10 hour drive has now taken on a new life and the receivers and customers don't care. "It's part of the job and comes with the territory" (so I have been told on more than one occasion) and the list goes on. Nobody seems to allow for these kind of delays.

Who should make that allowance, and why? Everyone on the truck side of the business, owners, dispatchers, drivers, are asking "what about this?" and "what about that?", but they are forgetting one VERY important thing ...
The only difference between an electronic log and a paper log is how you record the data. One is with ink and the other is with bits and bytes.
THE RULES HAVE NOT CHANGED.
So, delays at the border, for instance, don't change whether you're on paper or electronic ... it's just easier to cheat on paper. When you cheat you're not "helping" your customer. You are just covering up his mistakes and inefficiencies.
Ask yourself this "Why is trucking taking up the slack in the supply chain?". For decades inefficient shippers and receivers have abused the trucking industry's ability to cheat the shit out of their logs. No more.
Inefficiency is going to have to take care of itself. Inefficiency is going to have to pay for its blunders.

Just another random thought ... JIT freight is going to become stupidly expensive.
 

Freight Broker

Well-Known Member
30
Anything about this business that is predicated on drivers "adjusting" their logs will have to change as that option will nolonger be available to them.
 
Top